TESTIMONY OF ALFREADIA RIGGS
The testimony of Alfreadia Riggs was taken at 10:30 a.m., on April 1, 1964, in the office of the U.S. attorney, 301 Post Office Building, Bryan and Ervay Streets, Dallas, Tex., by Mr. Leon D. Hubert, Jr., assistant counsel of the President's Commission.
Mr. HUBERT. This is the deposition of Alfreadia Riggs. Mr. Riggs, my name is Leon Hubert. I am a member of the advisory staff of the General Counsel of the President's Commission. Under the provisions of the Executive Order 11130, dated November 29, 1963, the joint resolution of Congress No. 137, the rules of procedure adopted by the Commission in conformance with the Executive order and the joint resolution, I have been authorized to take a sworn deposition from you. I state to you now that the general nature of the Commission's inquiry is to ascertain, evaluate and report upon the facts relating to the assassination of President Kennedy and the subsequent violent death of Lee Harvey Oswald.
In particular, to you, Mr. Riggs, the nature of the inquiry today is to determine the facts that you know about the death of Oswald and any other pertinent facts you may know about the general inquiry. Now, Mr. Riggs, you have been--appeared here by virtue of a request made that you do appear.
Under the rules adopted then by the Commission you are entitled to a 3-day written notice prior to the taking of your deposition, but the rules also provide that a witness may waive the 3-day notice if he wishes to do so. Do you wish to waive the 3-day notice and testify now?
Mr. RIGGS. I will testify now.
Mr. HUBERT. All right. Will you stand and raise your right hand so that you may be sworn? Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. State your name.
Mr. RIGGS. Alfreadia Riggs.
Mr. HUBERT. Your age?
Mr. RIGGS. 35.
Mr. HUBERT. Your residence?
Mr. RIGGS. Right now I live at 49--I mean 5942 Highland Hill Drive.
Mr. HUBERT. Highland Hill?
Mr. RIGGS. Highland Village--Village Drive.
Mr. HUBERT. Highland Village Drive. Is that in Dallas?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. What is your occupation, Mr. Riggs?
Mr. RIGGS. I'm a porter.
Mr. HUBERT. For the city of Dallas?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes.
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Mr. HUBERT. At city hall?
Mr. RIGGS. At city hall.
Mr. HUBERT. How long have you been so employed?
Mr. RIGGS. Oh, approximately 7 years.
Mr. HUBERT. What was your occupation before that?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, I was--drove a truck.
Mr. HUBERT. For the city?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; for the Sunshine Laundry.
Mr. HUBERT. How long have you been employed as a porter at the municipal building in Dallas?
Mr. RIGGS. That is approximately 7 years.
Mr. HUBERT. Seven years. In other words, all the time you have been working there----
Mr. RIGGS. That is only----
Mr. HUBERT. For Dallas Public Works Department you have worked in that building?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. What are your hours?
Mr. RIGGS. Generally from 6 until 2:45.
Mr. HUBERT. Six in the morning?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Is that every day.
Mr. RIGGS. Yes; every day except Saturday and Sunday. Actually, sometimes I work weekends. We do a little extra work on Saturday and Sunday.
Mr. HUBERT. Do you get paid extra for that?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Who determines when you do extra work?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, the head porter and our supervising engineer, Mr. Homer Garland usually picks out certain things for us to do, and the head porter will tell us.
Mr. HUBERT. Who is the head porter?
Mr. RIGGS. Charles Gill.
Mr. HUBERT. G-i-l-l?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, I understand that you were working and on duty on November 24, the date that Oswald was shot.
Mr. RIGGS. That's right, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Why were you working that day?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, I was doing work inside the new city hall. Well, in the old building. We was cleaning the floors, because we had quite a few photographers in around, and they wanted us to keep the stuff off the floor.
Mr. HUBERT. By the old building you mean the building now occupied by the Dallas Police Department?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. The new building that you refer to is the municipal building?
Mr. RIGGS. Municipal building, yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. What time did you report for work?
Mr. RIGGS. I would say 7 o'clock, 7 o'clock-that morning.
Mr. HUBERT. Who ordered you to go to work?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, Gill.
Mr. HUBERT. Had you worked the day before, too?
Mr. RIGGS. This was on----
Mr. HUBERT. Sunday.
Mr. RIGGS. Sunday, no, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Had you worked on Saturday?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; I don't believe I worked that Saturday.
Mr. HUBERT. Had you worked on Friday night until Saturday morning?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; I was absent, actually, I worked, you know--it is my regular work through--weekly day from 6 until 2:45, and like I say, if you work weekends, usually work from 7 until 3. Actually, from 6 and--until 3. Usually come in a little earlier at various times, but this day I believe I came in at 7.
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Mr. HUBERT. What I mean is that on Saturday, the day before this day, did you work your regular hours or----
Mr. RIGGS. I'm trying to think, because we had quite a bit of work that weekend, because actually, we had quite a few people over in the other building. They sent different ones. Only time I remember is--that day I don't know whether I worked that night before then, because I had worked quite a bit on that weekend, too.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, for the purposes of identification, I'm going to mark a document which purports to be a photostatic copy of a sign-in sheet.
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Of porters and maids at the city hall on November 24, 1963, as follows: "Dallas, Texas, April 1, 1964. Exhibit No. 5128, deposition of Alfreadia Riggs." I am signing my name, and then another document also purporting to be sign-in sheet for the city hall porters and maids, dated November 23, 1963, and I am marking that at the bottom, "Dallas, Texas, April 1, 1964. Exhibit 5128-A, Deposition of Alfreadia Riggs." I am signing my name on it. Now, I will ask you to look at this document that has been marked Exhibit 5128, and see if your name is on it in print, and if your handwriting is on that document?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Is that your--next to your printed name is that your signature?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. And the two columns that appear, "Sign in 7 a.m.," "Sign out 5:30 p.m."--no, 3 p.m., is that your handwriting, too?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Both of those?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, look at the document marked 5128-A. Next to your printed name I see A.R. those are your initials?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, there is a sign-in 11 p.m., and a sign-out at 7 a.m. does that mean you went on duty at 11 o'clock on that Saturday night, and got off at 7 o'clock in the morning, Sunday, or does it mean you signed in at 11 o'clock on Friday night and got off at 7 o'clock on Saturday morning?
Mr. RIGGS. This, I believe I worked that night.
Mr. HUBERT. Which night?
Mr. RIGGS. When it says--Saturday, 23.
Mr. HUBERT. Until Sunday morning?
Mr. RIGGS. Until Sunday morning. That is when I was signing out, and I worked right on through that Sunday.
Mr. HUBERT. In other words, you didn't go home at all?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; not until 3 p.m.
Mr. HUBERT. So, what it amounts to is that you started at 11 o'clock Saturday night and carried clean on through until that Sunday, but you signed in and signed out twice?
Mr. RIGGS. We usually have to do that on two different sheets.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, you were assigned particularly to what location?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, just 11--from 11 to 7, it was on the elevators.
Mr. HUBERT. Yes.
Mr. RIGGS. From 11 o'clock that night until 7 o'clock the next morning I was on the elevators, and then on this other deal, from 7 until 3 was cleaning up the Police and Courts Building.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, when you got off the elevator at 7 o'clock, who relieved you?
Mr. RIGGS. McKinzie, I believe.
Mr. HUBERT. Louis McKinzie?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. When did you finish cleaning up the police building?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, we never did finish cleaning it up, because after the incident came about----
Mr. HUBERT. After Oswald was shot, you mean?
Mr. RIGGS. There was so much disturbance in the halls, actually, I was never able to get back over there in the building to clean it up.
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Mr. HUBERT. Were you in the municipal building at any time during the 24th?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. I am not talking about the police building, I am talking about the municipal building?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Did you do any work in the municipal building?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. How did you get from the municipal building to--no, from the police building where you were working to the municipal building?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, I came down through the basement. It wasn't--trying to think all who were down in the basement. We was all standing around. It was Harold, Gill, Kelly, and if I'm not mistaken, I think Pierce all standing around in the basement, and the police was searching the rafters and checking the cars for guns and things, and finally whenever sergeant--actually I don't know exactly his name gave orders for them to clear out everybody in the basement down there, so, we got on the elevator and went to the first floor in order to look out the door. We--to see when they got him out to the ramp.
Mr. HUBERT. Yes.
Mr. RIGGS. I think Servance had opened up the front door in the municipal building, and we was standing between--which it has two doors, one stays locked all the time, and one stays open because they have a meter where people put their water deposits in a little box. He had opened the doors on the inside, and we was standing between the two doors.
Mr. HUBERT. Which doors are you talking about?
Mr. RIGGS. On Commerce Street side.
Mr. HUBERT. Who opened that door?
Mr. RIGGS. Servance.
Mr. HUBERT. Servance. Now, what other entrances are there to the first floor of the municipal building?
Mr. RIGGS. How many entrances?
Mr. HUBERT. Yes; how can you get into it?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, we have one that leaves from the first floor to the Police and Courts Building, which it stays shut over the weekend, or on the weekend.
Mr. HUBERT. Sort of a metal gate?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Swinging gate like an accordion. It swings out and blocks the corridor that runs between the two buildings?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Was that open or closed?
Mr. RIGGS. Closed.
Mr. HUBERT. You say that----
Mr. RIGGS. Kept closed.
Mr. HUBERT. Who keeps it closed?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, usually the porter that works at night closes it up.
Mr. HUBERT. Did you check it to see that it was closed?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; I looked and it seemed to be closed actually.
Mr. HUBERT. That is to say that this gate, like a metal gate that runs from the floor to the ceiling, was pulled to, but you don't know if it was locked?
Mr. RIGGS. No.
Mr. HUBERT. Is it possible to lock that door?
Mr. RIGGS. It is possible.
Mr. HUBERT. Is it possible to lock that corridor?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. So you have that door, you have an entrance from Commerce Street, and there is an entrance on Main Street?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. What was the condition of that door on Sunday?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, it was--well, I presume it was closed, too.
Mr. HUBERT. Is it usually?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; during the weekend the old building is closed. Like I
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say, I couldn't verify to say that it was closed or it was open, because actually, I did not check it, but----
Mr. HUBERT. You knew normally that it is closed?
Mr. RIGGS. It is closed, yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. And it locks so that you can't get in?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, what about the entrance to the building, that entrance and exit to the building, that leads to the alleyway?
Mr. RIGGS. The heavy back door back there?
Mr. HUBERT. There is a back door back there, isn't there?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, does that door remain open, or closed, or what?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, it remains closed, too.
Mr. HUBERT. Closed all the time?
Mr. RIGGS. All the time. We usually keep a key on the elevator that will open the back door.
Mr. HUBERT. The door that goes to the alley?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; that goes into this alley, but it will not open either the front door or the Harwood side or Main side.
Mr. HUBERT. That key is kept on a ring in the elevator?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, to go from the main floor of the municipal building, that is, from the first floor to that alleyway, you have to go through the service elevator, don't you?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. And the service elevator has two doors?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. One that opens up on the Main Street corridor of the municipal building, and the other one that opens up on a corridor and leads to the backdoor that leads to the alleyway?
Mr. RIGGS. To the alleyway.
Mr. HUBERT. And the key to that back door is in the elevator?
Mr. RIGGS. On the elevator, yes, sir. Now, there is another way, too, on the first floor that you can go down the stairway and go to the basement from the the first floor.
Mr. HUBERT. Is that the fire escape?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. And that is never closed?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. So that if anybody is on the first floor they can get into the basement by using the fire escape, or using the elevator?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, besides the service elevator that we already talked about, the one that has two doors, there are two other elevators on that floor?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; but they usually cut off. They don't have but one elevator, and call it the freight elevator, the one that runs over the weekend.
Mr. HUBERT. The other two were closed?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. They were closed that day?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; they were cut off.
Mr. HUBERT. All right, now, I think you were saying that Mr. Servance opened the Commerce Street door, is that correct?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. If you will, tell us about that.
Mr. RIGGS. Well, after we left from the basement and went to the first floor, he opened the door on the Commerce Street side, and we stood up there between the two doors, approximately, I'd say 45 minutes to an hour.
Mr. HUBERT. When you say between the two doors, you mean that on Commerce Street there is an outside door, and a sort of a vestibule, and then inside doors?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes.
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Mr. HUBERT. Sort of wind-break doors?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; which actually, the outside door stays open because they have, like I said, they have the deposit meter where you can pay your bills and they keep it open.
Mr. HUBERT. So that the outside doors on the Commerce Street side are always open, but then the inside doors also on the Commerce Street side are closed on weekends?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, Servance opened the inside door and then where did you all go?
Mr. RIGGS. We stood in between.
Mr. HUBERT. In--you never did go out the outside door?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; because we had an officer outside the door. He was standing on the steps there.
Mr. HUBERT. All right, what happened after that?
Mr. RIGGS. After we stood around there a certain length of time, I don't know exactly how long, I'd say approximately 45 minutes or an hour, then the armored car came up, and they started backing down the ramp, and Harold and myself decided that we would----
Mr. HUBERT. Pardon. Fuqua?
Mr. RIGGS. Fuqua; yes, sir. We decided we would try to go down in the police locker room and maybe watch it on television. We came from the first floor----
Mr. HUBERT. Well, you left the Commerce Street entrance--did you close it? Did you lock it up?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; because Servance and the rest of them were still standing up there.
Mr. HUBERT. So, you left before they did, and you don't know whether he locked it or not?
Mr. RIGGS. Then only Harold and myself left. We came in the elevator, I got the keys, unlocked the back door, and I locked it back. I still had the keys.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, when you went through the elevator door, did you leave it open?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. The elevator door that is on the alleyway side was left open?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. And you took the key out of the elevator for the back door on the alleyway, and you opened that back door?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, you kept the key?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, did you leave that back door open?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Well, what do you mean?
Mr. RIGGS. I made sure I locked it back, because actually we usually are supposed to lock the door, keep it locked, and when I unlocked the door from the inside and in turn, took the key and put it on the other side and locked it back.
Mr. HUBERT. All right, then what did you do?
Mr. RIGGS. We left from the alleyway and walked to the left as we went out the back door.
Mr. HUBERT. Towards Main Street?
Mr. RIGGS. Towards Main Street, yes, sir; and got to Main Street, turned left going towards Harwood, and then as we passed--which is a driveway that leads down to the ramp on the Main Street side, well, we sort of glanced down through that-a-way to see, you understand. We saw that armored car which we couldn't see from up there on the top. Then we left, and went to Harwood, made a left, which was going towards Commerce off of Main Street, which is on Harwood, and as you get to the--between the blocks of the building, half way, they have a--steps that leads down into the basement.
Mr. HUBERT. On the Harwood Street side of the steps that lead down into the basement? Did you go down those steps?
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Mr. RIGGS. Actually, Harold asked me to go down and check and see if it would be all right for us to go down because we were under the impression that they had the police--had a police officer on the door. After I went down and checked and there wasn't anyone and then I turned and told him to come down and he and I came on down too, and well, the photographers and all was in the basement. All--we passed on by, and went down to the police basement, which is--opposite from the prop room. You have to go down the hall and down the steps.
Mr. HUBERT. You mean you went down into the locker room? That is where all the policemen have their lockers and there's a recreation room and television and----
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; and television and--and there was a jail attendant down there, actually he didn't work in the jail office, he is not a policeman, but he works in the jail office.
Mr. HUBERT. What is his name? Do you know?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; I really don't. He told us that he didn't think they were going to show it on television. He imagined they were going to run a tape and show it later on. Said, "Well, we should have stayed up there. Maybe we could have seen him when they brought him out--" While we were down there I bought a little can of soup, or chili or something, and I was eating as we came back up to the--and we stood on the opposite wall from the corridor that leads out to the basement from the hallway that goes out to the basement, and where it has a door--I'm sorry, I couldn't explain, but actually it leads to the basement, goes where they park the cars. We was standing up--opposite in other words, two corridors, you understand, separate that, and well, we was standing up there maybe about 5 minutes, one of the newspapermen said, "Here he come, here he come," and well, we got on the other side of the wall and was trying to look, well, so much rushing and all that actually we didn't see anything, and then did hear the shot, didn't actually sound like a shot, sort of muffled out.
Mr. HUBERT. Were you in the basement at that time?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. On the Commerce Street side, or the Main Street side?
Mr. RIGGS. It was in between, because it is---if you had been down there, there is a way that comes through the basement, pass by the jail office and corridor where you turn left, and go down there, turn right, and police assembly room is down at the far end, and go up there way, and go----
Mr. HUBERT. Did you go through the engineer's room?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; this is down in the police building where the records, the information is.
Mr. HUBERT. Well, perhaps if you look at this thing over here, this mockup, you will be able to clarify this. Now, this is the jail office.
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. And see back over there is the parking area. This mockup doesn't show the elevators, but I have a map here which is a chart, really, of that same area only more extensive. For instance, here is the jail office, here are these two ramps, and this mockup only goes to here, you see?
Mr. RIGGS. Uh-huh.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, what I want you to do is to identify this first by marking as follows: "Dallas, Texas, April 1, 1964, Exhibit 5129, deposition of Alfreadia Riggs," I am signing my name on it, and so that the record may show that we are both talking about the same thing, I'm asking you to put your name below mine on there. Now, I want you to look at the mockup first and locate first where you were when the shot was fired, then we'll mark it on the map.
Mr. RIGGS. Well, actually, they didn't have it on here, just this part here is extended out, see what I am referring to is this corridor leads down here that goes to the police assembly room, this part here is--corridor here leads towards Commerce Street side. Now, it has--along here it has a corner here, that is what--two corridors there, and this is just a wall what leads into the elevators. Now, when--actually when they--when they was bringing him out, we were standing on this side, and when they brought him out we moved from here over to here [indicating].
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Mr. HUBERT. All right. Now, sir, you have testified that actually, your first position is not shown on either the mockup or the map?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. But, if it were on the map, it would be shown at the bottom of the map?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. And you moved up to a position about here [indicating]?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. So, I am marking an "X" and putting a circle around it as to the position you moved to when you heard the shot, right?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. I am marking in my own handwriting, "Position of Alfreadia Riggs at the time of shooting." I am putting that in a circle and connecting it to the smaller circle with the "X" in it. The smaller circle with the "X" in it being the spot at which Alfreadia Riggs testified he was standing at the time of the shot, is that correct?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. And Fuqua was with you?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, you had come from a position that, if it were on the map, would be toward the bottom of the map?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. Do you recognize the position of the service elevator here?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. After you had been told to get out of the parking area marked here, and you had gone up with these others on the service elevator to the first floor, did you ever get back into this part on the map called parking area?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, only after everything was over.
Mr. HUBERT. I understand, but prior to the shooting, you never did get back?
Mr. RIGGS. Never did get back down there; no, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. You had gone through the service elevator, not on the area shown by this Exhibit 5129, because that is the basement area?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. But on that same service elevator on the next floor up?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. And went through that elevator to the back door, turned to your left onto Main Street, passed the ramp on Main Street, went over to Harwood Street, went down into the basement area through the Harwood Street----
Mr. RIGGS. Entrance; yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Entrance that goes down to the basement. Then you went to the recreation room and finally came to the position you indicated just before the shooting?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. How did you get back to the main floor of the municipal building after the shooting?
Mr. RIGGS. After the shooting--during the excitement and that, during the excitement Harold and I, we went over to the police information room over there to get out of the way of the traffic. The police was all--they was closing all the entrances and wasn't letting anyone in and letting no one out, so, in order to keep from being in the way, we went inside the information room, and stayed over there, I imagine 30 minutes, 20 or 30 minutes, and Harold asked chief--I think it was Chief Lumpkin for him to escort us from there to the basement, because I think he wanted to go home, or his time was up or something. He wanted to get out of there, because it made him pretty nervous, and Chief Lumpkin escorted us through the corridor there that leads to the basement to the parking area, and we went over there and stayed, or was down in the basement, and after the time elapsed, I went down in our porter room and stayed around there until time for me to get off.
Mr. HUBERT. What did you do with the keys that you had?
Mr. RIGGS. I put them back in the elevator.
Mr. HUBERT. You put them back in the elevator on what floor?
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Mr. RIGGS. In the basement there.
Mr. HUBERT. Was the elevator down in the basement then?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, I called it down.
Mr. HUBERT. Was McKinzie operating the elevator?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes; he was.
Mr. HUBERT. Did he see you put the keys back?
Mr. RIGGS. I don't know for sure. During the excitement and all of that, I think--I don't know whether he and I or someone got to talking about the incident, and I don't remember.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, you did not go out through the Main Street door when you went out with Fuqua?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; definitely.
Mr. HUBERT. Back in the alley?
Mr. RIGGS. Back in the alley; yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. And you had the keys with you all the time?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Why did you take the keys with you?
Mr. RIGGS. Well, because there was only this once that--well, actually, I usually, normally have a key. As a matter of fact, I have quite a few keys. I didn't have mine with me during that time, and that was the only one during that time that would open up that door that was available, and it stays in the elevator, we close that, because lots of times some of those porters in the other building will use the keys in the elevator to put trash out this back door.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, that door, as a matter of fact, can only be opened from either side. You need a key no matter which way you are coming from?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. It can't be set so that it is open?
Mr. RIGGS. You have to unlock it from the inside and going out, to lock it back, you have to lock it from the outside. In coming back through you have to unlock it from the outside with the key.
Mr. HUBERT. Well, now, I understood that that back door would not open in any way without a key so that if you went through it with a key it would close by itself and you would need a key to get back in again?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. You couldn't put a snap on that to keep it open?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. There is no snap?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; I don't think. You have to use a key.
Mr. HUBERT. You were in uniform that day?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. That uniform, is a well-known uniform?
Mr. RIGGS. It is gray with red letters. It has "City of Dallas," on the left side, and name on the right of it.
Mr. HUBERT. Your name sewed on?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir, embroidered on.
Mr. HUBERT. Right.
Mr. RIGGS. First initial and last name.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, I am showing you a document which purports to be a report of an interview of you by FBI Agent Jack Peden, and I am marking it for identification as follows: "Dallas, Tex., April 1, 1964, Exhibit 5130, deposition of Alfreadia Riggs," and putting my name on the first page and since it has a second page I am marking on the second page my initials in the lower right-hand corner. I would like you to read that report and see if it reflects the truth, as far as you know it?
Mr. RIGGS. That's right, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, in order that the record can show that we are both talking about the same document, I would ask you to sign your name below mine on the margin there, or next to it, and place your initials on the second page as I have done. Now, you have signed your name on the first page of Exhibit 5130, and your--put your initials on the second page. Have you read it?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Does it represent the truth?
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Mr. RIGGS. That's right.
Mr. HUBERT. Any corrections or alterations to be made, or anything?
Mr. RIGGS. My--no, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Are you willing to state that if we consider the facts stated in Exhibit 5130 and the facts as stated by you in this deposition that we have everything whatsoever that you now know about this matter?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Nothing that is left out?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Everything is correct?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir. Everything is correct.
Mr. HUBERT. I should have added that if we also consider the information you have testified to on Exhibit 5128 and 5128- A, that is the sign-in sheet, we have the full information. of that?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. All right. Now, have you been previously interviewed by any member of the President's Commission?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; I haven't.
Mr. HUBERT. You have not been interviewed previously by me, or anybody who identified themselves as being connected with the President's Commission?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. All right, Alfreadia, I just want to get clear once again on one point. Is it possible, at all, that you went out of the municipal building through the Main Street entrance?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. With Fuqua?
Mr. RIGGS. No, sir; we definitely went through the back door.
Mr. HUBERT. You and Fuqua?
Mr. RIGGS. Yes, sir; me and Harold Fuqua.
Mr. HUBERT. All right, that's all, thank you very much.